Archive Interview: PVC11

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Speaker 1:

interviewerPVC11

Speaker 2:

informantPVC11a

Age Group:

41-50

Gender:

Male

Residence:

Tyneside - Newcastle

Education:

Unknown

Occupation:

Teacher

Speaker 3:

informantPVC11b

Age Group:

41-50

Gender:

Male

Residence:

Tyneside - Newcastle

Education:

Unknown

Occupation:

Local Government Officer

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Click a theme in the menu below to highlight related keywords in the transcript.

  Interview Transcript

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 1:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

but that's yours

Speaker 3:

very impressed and not only that I think I ought to make a speech

Speaker 1:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

ehm

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

it's it's the first time since I left Proctor and Gamble that I've actually ever been presented

Speaker 2:

with anything

Speaker 3:

with anything whatsoever (laughter)

Speaker 2:

well apparently there's certain categories of people get presented them if you're a school governor you get a free one if you're a member of staff you get a free one if you're a if you're a friend of Rutherford that's the PTA you get one and if you're a former pupil who they happen to see knocking about you'll get one so

Speaker 3:

(unclear) see

Speaker 2:

I'm I think I qualify on all four counts (laughter) so so (unclear) I'm going to end up with four of the damn things

Speaker 3:

well I'm very very impressed and I'm deeply grateful

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

and my thanks to those people who are dispu distributing these marvellous historic emblems

Speaker 2:

it was yours anyway (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

of what was once eh a school with a very high reputation

Speaker 2:

I know yeah

Speaker 3:

that's eh

Speaker 2:

(unclear) I'm afraid the reputation isn't quite so high now

Speaker 3:

well one of the interesting things is I notice eh I was informed by one of my colleagues recently that the ehm head at Cramlington High is gradually reintroducing school uniform

Speaker 2:

we can not we've had a row about this because we are uniform right believe it or not you wouldn't notice it if you went to (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

supposed we're supposed to (pause) the school we've merged with (pause) which is Redewood which used to be s Slatyford

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

Slatyford merged with John Marley and because Redewood (pause) had two thousand pupils and it's actually it's actually declined (pause) down to about (pause) about four hundred now so they're merging them with us but actually they're going to shut Redewood down it'll just disappear the school eventually next year they're just going to bulldoze it and the site'll become something I don't know eh they don't have a uniform so there's a battle going on now as to whether the new school'll have uniform or not their governors don't want it to our governors do (pause) so I mean all I've said is for goodness sake get rid of the tie because there's nothing looks worse than little girls wearing ties you know what I mean I mean it's all right

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

for lads I suppose to a certain extent but even (unclear) I mean most people don't wear ties I mean girls never wear ties do they in their later life

Speaker 3:

I take your point in a way I r I seem to remember f feeling when I was at Rutherford that there was a certain amount of pride in the uniform

Speaker 2:

oh yeah yeah

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh I don't I don't mind the uniform what we have

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

what we have now is a sweatshirt

Speaker 3:

right

Speaker 2:

have a sweatshirt with a badge

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

and they've got to wear

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

trousers or a skirt or

Speaker 3:

(unclear) I notice that's coming in more and more now for certainly for younger kids (interruption) ehm

Speaker 2:

aye well it's sweatshirts (unclear)

Speaker 3:

it's something practical it's something their parents can afford

Speaker 2:

that's right it's (interruption) only six pound

Speaker 3:

and it's easily available (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

six or seven pound and it lasts (pause) in the wash and they're warm in the winter you know

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

so if you just wear that with a shirt and a badge (pause) and black or grey trousers

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

or a blue skirt or whatever that looks all right I mean I wouldn't but I mean there's no way they're ever going to get blazers and caps I've still got a cap somewhere

Speaker 3:

I've still got my old school tie

Speaker 2:

have you

Speaker 3:

mm-hm (unclear)

Speaker 2:

you had a (unclear) tie didn't you

Speaker 3:

mm-hm (unclear) still got it (pause) but ehm (pause) I can appreciate the the need to have something practical and affordable (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

well that's it

Speaker 3:

it still brings a lot of sort of pride in the establishment (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh it doe I think I think you're right I think you're right but of course it can cause a lot of hassle where people (pause) don't (pause) if they refuse to wear it you're into confrontation you know

Speaker 3:

mm-hm

Speaker 2:

and what do you do do you send them home (pause) which is what they do (unclear) Walker they stand at the door of the school and if they come in without their uniform on get packed off home you've either got to be totally uniform or not (pause) and we've always fallen between two stones basically what we've done is (pause) we've said we've got a uniform and if kids don't come in it we don't enforce it you know we say 'well you've got to wear your uniform tomorrow and take your earrings out and take' (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

that's just the boys (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 3:

I remember (unclear) who was that horrible headmaster we had when we first went there (pause) ehm

Speaker 2:

not (NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 3:

(NAME) (NAME) (pause) ehm my shoes fell apart and my mum was (pause) working at Fenwick's at the time and didn't have a lot of money dad was dead and I desperately needed shoes and she foolishly gave me some money and sent me into town to buy some (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 2:

so what did you buy a model aero (laughter)

Speaker 3:

no I bought a pair of shoes with like three inch thick crepe soles

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

and big buckles over the top and perfectly practical shoes in a way but (pause) eh (NAME) pulled me up in the corridor (unclear) 'can't your parents afford decent clothes'

Speaker 2:

good heavens

Speaker 3:

in front of a lot of other kids so I remember my mam being very upset

Speaker 2:

yes (unclear)

Speaker 3:

although it was in fact my fault

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

basically ehm 'you're just drawing attention to yourself son' (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) oh I think we're a bit (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

ehm (unclear) 'you know you can get a clothing grant'

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) 'excuse me sir but we've already applied for a clothing grant and it's been turned down' (laughter) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

you can't get them now

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

they've stopped them

Speaker 3:

(unclear) no such thing is there (pause) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

but I mean eh (pause) like in our day I suppose most people went to grammar school wanted to wear a uniform didn't they (pause) I mean like you say you were I remember I remember looking at mine hanging up in the wardrobe before I went and it was great I loved it

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

and I always wore it right through to sixth form I wore uniform

Speaker 3:

(unclear) where was that shop at the top end of Grainger Street that everybody had to go

Speaker 2:

Isaac Whalton's

Speaker 3:

(unclear) Raymond Barnes and (interruption) Isaac Whalton's

Speaker 2:

oh (unclear) Raymond Barnes and Isaac Whalton's and the Co op (interruption) there were three (unclear)

Speaker 3:

the parents spent a fortune (unclear) two football strips

Speaker 2:

oh that's right

Speaker 3:

and cricket gear and (unclear) PT gear and all (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear) and a r a w a black and white

Speaker 3:

that's right

Speaker 2:

apron (unclear)

Speaker 3:

that's right black for metalwork white for woodwork

Speaker 2:

what what a farce ay

Speaker 3:

and ehm oh very practical they were too (unclear) (pause) they did cost a bit of a fortune but

Speaker 2:

the football strip you had (unclear) boots and socks and there was two you had to wear two strip was it a black a red

Speaker 3:

there were two strips a red and a white

Speaker 2:

ah that's right (unclear)

Speaker 3:

and ehm

Speaker 2:

and black shorts and white shorts (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

I remember all the family being gathered in our house and I had to do a effectively a fashion parade (unclear)

Speaker 2:

all of it

Speaker 3:

I put on every bit one after the other and then another load of relatives came in the next night and I had to do it all over again and (unclear) immensely proud of us (pause) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

actually one one thing that's interesting with this ehm with this merger you know all the money that the school had ehm like the Robert Wood travel grants

Speaker 3:

I got one

Speaker 2:

you got one you got a good one

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

did you did you got to France

Speaker 3:

yes I hitch hiked round France with (NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 2:

oh that's right aye I got a one for four quid to go to Scotland with (NAME) (NAME) you got more than that

Speaker 3:

I think we got (pause) if I remember rightly ten quid each

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

and we went to France for a month

Speaker 2:

(laughter) on ten quid (laughter)

Speaker 3:

something like twenty five years later I still had the tent that I bought with the price tag on it

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

it was fifty two and six or something (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) I remember when I went to fra I had a little one from Millet's I remember it was thirty bob it was it was only a o like a one man thing with no groundsheet (unclear) nothing but I got all th all those all those endowments because when the schools mer when the boys' and girls' schools merged the girls' school has even more endowments it's all ehm you know the eh (pause) the Jemima Puddleduck or whatever is award for poor girls and all this sort of thing but it it's specifically some of them are specifically for girls some are specifically for boys but they were all

Speaker 3:

mm

Speaker 2:

for this Rutherford school (pause) right so the Robert Wood one has a lot of money in it (pause) still (pause) now apparently what he used to do and I didn't know this every Christmas he used to come up and he used to take all the staff all the staff to the eh County Hotel for a for lu for dinner at night

Speaker 3:

mm

Speaker 2:

and paid for the lot and then he then (unclear) people started insisting on bringing their wives and things and he got sick he said 'I'm not doing it anymore' and that was it but that money's all there so what they thought was this new school they'll just transfer the money you see but apparently it isn't quite as easy as that because it's been actually endowed for the use of Rutherford School and so (unclear) (unclear) and eh (pause) one of the trustees is (NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) who's still going strong

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

aye well well the last (unclear) he came in you know you know all the old pictures of the heads the old heads they used to put up (interruption) in the entrance hall (interruption)

Speaker 3:

(interruption) yeah (interruption) Gaunt and all the rest (interruption) of them

Speaker 2:

aye Gaunt and there was some actually a big oil painting of Rutherford as well (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

yes there was

Speaker 2:

well the last (unclear) had took them all down because she said 'oh God' (unclear) grammar school she was very much a comprehensive school head you know wanted nothing to do with the grammar school (unclear) they were even going to get rid of the war memorial (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

and he (NAME) (NAME) came in and he said ehm 'where are the pictures gone' and eh (pause) (NAME) (NAME) says 'oh we've put them into storage' and he says 'well if you want any more money from the Robert Wood (pause) Trust'

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

he said 'you'd better get them back up' (laughter)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

they were they were up the next day aye (laughter) aye so

Speaker 3:

well (unclear)

Speaker 2:

but he said (pause) he said if the if if the school changes its name he says it's highly unlikely he said Robert the Robert Wood trustees would give them anything so what they're going to do with all that money I don't know so that that's a another thing

Speaker 3:

there's always the lifeboat (unclear) institution

Speaker 2:

well that's right it's difficult with money (unclear) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

what surprises me thinking back is (pause) ehm (pause) I I'm sometimes a little surprised at some of the things I actually did when I was young (pause) it would be unthinkable now to let your sixteen year old son and somebody else's sixteen year old son

Speaker 2:

go to France

Speaker 3:

hitch hike round the whole of bloody France for a (interruption) month

Speaker 2:

yeah that's right aye

Speaker 3:

quite honestly

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

it'd be out of the question wouldn't it

Speaker 2:

yeah well I I think I mean I went off (unclear) was a bit older and I (unclear) I was about I think I was eighteen it was the year I left school I went out on my own and I mean my mother let me you know I mean she never said 'don't go' or 'watch yourself' or anything I mean I got in a few scrapes but

Speaker 3:

I'm pretty sure my mum must have been absolute (pause) worried sick

Speaker 2:

yeah well I'm sure mine was as well but she never said (interruption) anything

Speaker 3:

(unclear) probably probably thought it was something I had to do or

Speaker 2:

(laughter) that's the (unclear)

Speaker 3:

in a funny sort of way was quite pleased that I was doing because she was going round no doubt telling all the neighbours 'oh you know where my (NAME) is now' (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) that's right but I mean now (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

I've still got the postcards I sent home

Speaker 2:

have you

Speaker 3:

from ever every town I I went to

Speaker 2:

did you put them on a map (unclear) or something (unclear)

Speaker 3:

no every town I went to I bought one of those little tourist badges

Speaker 2:

oh (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) peakie cap thing which I wore religiously despite the fact that it was far too small and ehm I can remember first exercise in actually using French in France

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

was to use a dictionary to find out how to buy a needle and some thread and every town we went to we got one of these little cloth badges and I've still got the hat

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

with all the badges and my mum kept all the eh postcards that I sent home and to this day ehm I find it amazing sometimes to read what I wrote all (interruption) those years ago

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) writing was tiny

Speaker 2:

aye

Speaker 3:

it was packed in it was (pause) 'on schedule' or 'three days behind schedule' you know 'had a lift from'

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

'fourteen nuns in a (pause) (interruption) hay wagon' and

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

and the the the things that sort of stuck out from (pause) that few days (unclear) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

I can remember getting a lift off some nuns and they'd b I'll tell you what they'd bought (pause) it was up in the north of France somewhere it was somewhere near arras I think and they'd bought they had a little Citroen what was it what the Citroen called the little the really

Speaker 3:

(unclear) 2CV

Speaker 2:

2CV

Speaker 3:

that's what we that's what we were in (unclear)

Speaker 2:

two c

Speaker 3:

canvas seat with the m

Speaker 2:

canvas

Speaker 3:

metal tubes

Speaker 2:

and it was brand new

Speaker 3:

there was two of us in the back there (interruption) with with

Speaker 1:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

rucksacks up to the ceiling we couldn't see where we were going

Speaker 2:

(laughter) well these two stopped and they said you know did I want a lift (unclear) nobody else had stopped so I (unclear) lift and they were really really all they were out for they were out to try this little car out so they were tootling round and they ended up back at their convent and they said 'come in and have a cup of tea' so I went in and had a well a cup of coffee (unclear) I had a cup of coffee cup of tea and they said 'well we'll drop you off' and they dropped me off I was only about a mile further down the road than when I started off

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

I think they just wanted me to admire their car it was it was a good little car

Speaker 3:

I think it it's something that goes on with you into later life though because I I'm surprised in a way (pause) ehm al although I didn't make it in the RAF (pause) that I got through those three years and those three years did a lot to me I'm still surprised and amazed sometimes when I look back at redoing all the plumbing in my old house

Speaker 2:

mm-hm

Speaker 3:

never having done any plumbing before how could I have dreamed of taking that on I must have been absolutely mad

Speaker 2:

you were

Speaker 3:

and I wonder if it it's

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

something to do with ehm being allowed to do things when you were young

Speaker 2:

aye right yeah yeah

Speaker 3:

and you're not (interruption) frightened to try things later on in life because you think well I've done it before

Speaker 2:

yeah right right yeah yeah right

Speaker 3:

all I've got to do is read the instructions sort of thing and

Speaker 2:

and have a little bit of practical skill

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

yeah actually my father used to say that because he (pause) his mother well his father went went to live in Spain eh in the nineteen thirties he was doing something to do with ships so his mother was left at home and she did everything in the house and she taught herself how to do things like put put windows in and (pause) and eh like all the joinery work and everything in the house he n he never did anything and he said to me that was a big mistake because when he got older (pause) he couldn't do anything because his mother used to do it all you know I mean all the like handyman things you'd expect a man to do

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

his mother had done so he was sackless and eh I mean when I was young I used to paint and decorate and so on because there was nobody else to do it but when it came when it comes to I mean I would never dream of doing any plumbing I mean it would be the kiss of death there's no doubt about that I just wouldn't have the confidence wouldn't have the confidence (unclear)

Speaker 3:

well (unclear) it's basically it's connecting pipes together (pause) so I started off by getting some bits and pieces of pipe and

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

standard fittings (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

did you practice

Speaker 3:

I went out and a little bit of practice to see what (interruption) would happen

Speaker 2:

oh right right

Speaker 3:

and ehm the actual logic of it was just ordinary physics sort of heads of water and

Speaker 2:

no I could understand it I could understand the workings of it I would just be

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

it would be the you know the fastening things together do they fasten together easy

Speaker 3:

I used a lot of pre soldered joints which have already got a little ehm like groove

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

in the outer so you've got two pieces of pipe (unclear) which are joined by a sleeve that fits over the joint

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

and within that sleeve there's a groove that contains solder

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

and the trick is to get everything absolutely spotlessly clean (pause) before you start with wire wool

Speaker 2:

mm-hm

Speaker 3:

inside and out smear on a bit of eh ordinary flux and then I bought a gas torch which I've used ever since and ehm you also need a bit of extra solder so you know you put just the right amount of heat on and when you see the little silver ring appear at the ends you put a bit more on with your stick of solder no trouble at all as long as ehm rule number one is observe and that's absolutely clean absolute cleanliness (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

so it's just it's just like a piece of copper that goes over (interruption) like a piece of

Speaker 3:

(unclear) just a sleeve but it's got a little bit of solder inside (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

that's all you have to do so what are these great big brass joint things what are they for

Speaker 3:

they're Conex (pause) fittings and ehm they're much more expensive

Speaker 2:

like that thing

Speaker 3:

yeah the advantage of them is that that's a well that's a gas fitting

Speaker 2:

yeah but be similar isn't it

Speaker 3:

ehm similar idea you've got an olive which (pause) as you screw the collar up

Speaker 2:

mm-hm

Speaker 3:

is

Speaker 2:

compressed

Speaker 3:

absolutely it's compressed against the pipe

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

the advantage of that (pause) although it's more expensive is that you can (pause) ehm reasonably take that joint apart again whereas if the joint is soldered together

Speaker 2:

you can't

Speaker 3:

you've got to actually saw that bit of pipe out (unclear) (interruption) remake the whole thing

Speaker 2:

oh put a new right

Speaker 3:

ehm so for instance you would never attach a tap to a pipe by soldering it in case you needed to replace the tap

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

so you would use Conex so you could always take that tap out (interruption) if it was something wrong with it

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

and ehm (pause) that was about it basically looking it up in a library book and asking other people who had done the same job themselves (unclear)

Speaker 2:

I mean I wouldn't mind trying a little job you know what I mean like a but I wouldn't (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

well that was my mistake I should probably have (pause) ehm well not a mistake as it turned out (pause) if I'd had the opportunity I would have liked to have done a little job but there wasn't a little job available

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

I'd been given a lot of the bits and pieces free anyway

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

and I felt as if I'd almost be letting my neighbour down

Speaker 2:

mm

Speaker 3:

if I didn't actually now have a go at all this stuff (laughter) s so off I went I made about sixty or seventy (pause) there was somewhere between sixty and seventy joints

Speaker 2:

good grief

Speaker 3:

in the whole system by the time I got it put together and then the acid test at the the end of the day is when you actually turn (interruption) the mains on

Speaker 2:

turn it on

Speaker 3:

(laughter) (unclear) comes out of it (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(unclear) I could just I could just see a whole house being ruined you know

Speaker 3:

no it was it was quite interesting

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) you know having to drill through the floors (unclear) through the ceilings and

Speaker 2:

well I mean I remember at ehm (pause) do you remember (NAME) (NAME) and that was me and soldering do you remember (NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 3:

eh very well indeed (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

I think he's still I think he's still knocking about

Speaker 3:

I I've seen him

Speaker 2:

he lives in I think he lives in Westerhope actually he used to

Speaker 3:

(unclear) the trick with (NAME) is if you wanted a good finish to what you were making keep ahead of everybody else because when it came to the next stage he would use your particular piece as a p as a demonstration of how to do the next stage so you got it done for you by (NAME) (laughter) that's why (interruption) I used to enjoy

Speaker 2:

I never cottoned on to that one I've got a I've still got well actually our (NAME)'s got ehm a scone cutter that was the only thing I ever made (interruption) that worked

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

I had a scone cutter and a pin tray

Speaker 3:

I've still got everything I ever made at school

Speaker 2:

have you

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

well that's all I made I made a scone cutter a pin tray a matchbox holder (interruption) in woodwork

Speaker 3:

the matchbox holder I remember yes I made that (unclear)

Speaker 2:

mine was very thin because I kept planing it and pl

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 1:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) and I was sawing the I remember I was sawing the bench at the same time those benches were brand new weren't they

Speaker 3:

teapot stand (pause) that was a little more complicated that was three (interruption) bits of wood (laughter)

Speaker 2:

I don't think I got I don't think I don't think I was allowed to get that far I got as far as the matchbox (unclear) I remember the matchbox one when I was what amazed me was I started off with the woodwork and then I then (unclear) went and did the metalwork I think you did woodwork for a term and metalwork for a term (unclear)

Speaker 3:

that's right that was the trouble you weren't allowed to concentrate on one or the other (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

and then you dropped it all at the end of the first year didn't you if you went (unclear) (unclear) or the G set I don't think you didn't do any art or

Speaker 3:

more or less there was very little chance of doing ehm very few people took things like O levels in woodwork and metalwork

Speaker 2:

that's right

Speaker 3:

I remember that

Speaker 2:

I remember going back in the sixth form to make a bow with (unclear) (laughter) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

oh yes the the laminated bows

Speaker 2:

(laughter) because it was it was a way of getting out of games (laughter) it was either

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

kick a football round the field or find something else to do and we dis we discovered archery

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

and then we discovered you could make your own bow (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) used to have millions of after school clubs (unclear) everything from the chemistry club to the maths club

Speaker 2:

oh there was loads yeah

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

I joined them all in the first year I was in everything scientific lecture society that was a one I was in (laughter) I didn't understand (interruption) a word

Speaker 3:

(unclear) and there was a lot of time spent after schools and at weekends on sports competitions

Speaker 2:

aye

Speaker 3:

between schools I don't think you get that so much now either

Speaker 2:

not so much no well people (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

you used to get like football leagues and swimming leagues and

Speaker 2:

oh we still have a football league ehm I mean the football's about the one thing that really goes you know that still goes

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

I mean Rutherford's still got a reputation there you know ehm

Speaker 3:

the baths were closed down weren't they

Speaker 2:

oh no (interruption) the baths are still open

Speaker 3:

(unclear) still open

Speaker 2:

aye well actually they were they were in need of severe repair and they spent three hundred and fifty thousand on them (interruption) like you wouldn't

Speaker 3:

not surprised after we had a go at them (laughter)

Speaker 2:

you wouldn't recognize them now they've there's no boards all the boards have gone

Speaker 3:

oh

Speaker 2:

the health and safety apparently you're not allowed to have boards

Speaker 3:

oh

Speaker 2:

so there's no springboard and that high diving board and everything are all gone there's no board and what they've done is they've lined it (pause) with some sort of plastic sort of like a plastic liner in but eh I mean the baths are still they're still good I I used until about a year ago I used to go in two or three times a week at night to just have a staff are allowed to go in and have a swim but eh

Speaker 3:

(NAME) (NAME) and (NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 2:

oh yeah (NAME) (NAME) he died didn't he

Speaker 3:

he did so did (NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 2:

did he oh well I suppose he would now

Speaker 3:

well after I left I used to go (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

be about a hundred (laughter)

Speaker 3:

he he used to go in there on ehm sort of Friday nights and Saturday mornings have a bit of a swim himself and do a lot of the maintenance

Speaker 2:

did he

Speaker 3:

(unclear) enough and (NAME) (NAME) and I used to walk up to the baths on a Saturday morning long after we left school and get a free swim in the (interruption) school baths (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) (NAME) was all for anybody who was

Speaker 2:

who was in to swimming

Speaker 3:

in to swimming (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

he was a good bloke actually yeah I couldn't swim it took me ages to learn to swim all of the all of the first year (pause) it took me to learn to swim (pause) and I was just I was just and I wouldn't jump in I was terrified to jump in

Speaker 3:

(NAME) (NAME)

Speaker 2:

he was a music teacher

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

with a French

Speaker 3:

music teacher (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

he spoke he did French as well didn't he (unclear) always have coffee

Speaker 3:

he could play a lot of instruments but it was noticeable from my memory he'd never let any of us e ever actually try to play any of them (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) aye (interruption) it wasn't exactly hands on in those days was it

Speaker 3:

(unclear) sit in rows and listen to a a seventy eight record (interruption) of Mendelssohn and

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

that's a useless gem of information about the cuckoo apparently a hundred years ago more eh this was on the radio a musical lady ehm who was in where she was in fairly comfortable circumstances checked the notes that the cuckoo sings against her piano and she found that the cuckoo at any time of the day any cuckoo always sings B flat F B flat F

Speaker 2:

does it

Speaker 3:

now that's been checked recently by scientists who recorded it all over the country day and night and all cuckoos still sing B flat F (laughter) B flat F now poor old Ludwig van van Beethoven was it

Speaker 2:

something like that (laughter)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) ehm donkeys years ago wrote a piece of music hope I've got the r the right the right one you'll get the punch line in a minute ehm in which he represented the cuckoo by the notes of the flute and he used the notes B flat F B flat F

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

but he was stone deaf

Speaker 2:

(unclear) that was Beethoven yeah he was deaf (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) how how did he know how did he know

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

one of the women one of the clerical assistants bless her heart she's a smashing lass 'he asked somebody'

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

(laughter) (pause) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

we we had this lass eh came to came to school about two year three years ago we got a new music teacher who's pretty well connected and eh he persuaded Evelyn Glennie to come and do a concert have you have you s have you seen her the percussionist

Speaker 3:

no

Speaker 2:

she's deaf it's amazing unbelievable

Speaker 3:

but can probably feel a lot of

Speaker 2:

she must there must be vibrations (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

in fact (unclear) percussion is (unclear)

Speaker 2:

yeah but I mean she play (interruption) it's like a

Speaker 3:

(unclear) nature

Speaker 2:

but she basically plays like a huge xylophone type thing you know but I mean she's absolutely incredible she plays in in orchestras and so on but she is deaf but apparently now she would cost about (laughter) four thousand pounds for a (laughter) concert so this was eh I mean I think he knew or but eh the kids thought she was fantastic you know because she let them come up and play with everything and (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

ah I've seen her on television I remember that she did ehm a sort of master class thing

Speaker 2:

that's right that's right yeah I think she's (interruption) Scottish

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

eh she was she was great

Speaker 3:

(unclear) you can imagine my consternation when (NAME) decided to take up percussion for her music (interruption) GCSE

Speaker 2:

(unclear) did she (laughter)

Speaker 3:

yeah she did it so a certain well meaning neighbour brought along a a sort of snare kit

Speaker 2:

oh crikey

Speaker 3:

(unclear) cymbals and hi-hat

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

there you are you can put that in your bedroom (unclear)

Speaker 2:

mm

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

there was a (unclear) here (NAME) thought about doing that once and I sort of just quietly (laughter)

Speaker 3:

I ruled that out (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh heavens

Speaker 3:

go and sit in the middle of the field (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) that's right

Speaker 3:

she also acquired a practice pad which was a little bit more acceptable which was effectively a wooden thing with a rubber disc

Speaker 2:

and what do you what do you you just you just beat on that do you yeah

Speaker 3:

but ehm that was quite interesting

Speaker 2:

did she do music

Speaker 3:

yes

Speaker 2:

oh I didn't know that well I know she's musical like

Speaker 3:

she did percussion and singing and in both cases she had to do compositions

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

and perform (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear) sings well doesn't she

Speaker 3:

she knows it she loves ehm anything to do with sort of theatrical work amateur dramatics she takes part in a lot of (interruption) school contests (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

does she does she does she still go to singing lessons

Speaker 3:

no ehm thank goodness

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

that was costing a ruddy (interruption) fortune

Speaker 2:

oh I know aye yes

Speaker 3:

ehm (pause) (unclear) I think ehm (pause) she's got a fairly wide base anyway in what she's taken at GCSE (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

pleased from that point of view

Speaker 2:

does she want to stay on

Speaker 3:

yes but she's very philosophical about the the results of the GCSEs her attitude is (pause) really laid back 'I've either passed them or I haven't passed them' (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) (unclear) fair enough (unclear) nothing you can do about it is there

Speaker 3:

she's ehm

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

she's taken a good range of I think it's at least eight (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh God is she it's Seaton Burn she's at isn't it

Speaker 3:

Seaton Burn

Speaker 2:

is that changing in some way

Speaker 3:

ehm

Speaker 2:

(unclear) is it going from

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

because there was a load of jobs advertised rece well fairly recently

Speaker 3:

yeah that's because the middle school ehm the middle school she went to (pause) in Dudley

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

has effectively closed down

Speaker 2:

oh

Speaker 3:

and it's been incorporated again with the high school (unclear)

Speaker 2:

so it's now eleven to

Speaker 3:

they're building like mad all on the same site and ehm the whole age group will go through (interruption) the same site (unclear)

Speaker 2:

mm so it's like eleven to eighteen now is it

Speaker 3:

which as usual created a huge furore

Speaker 2:

oh that's right yeah I noticed (unclear) bloke from our our place applied for a job he didn't get it (pause) ehm (pause) but eh I I thought there must have been some change in (pause) circumstances

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

when all the jobs were advertised that's the daft way they go (pause) well we all had to apply for our jobs

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

and be reappointed it's because it was I mean technically it's a new building a new (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

so did we and now we've got local government review again

Speaker 2:

(unclear) what happened then

Speaker 3:

you got compulsory competitive tendering next year and followed by a local government review the year after well actually the local government review is taking shape now (pause) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

we've we've already put forward our eh our own proposals and reasons why and ehm those in power then decide whether they're acceptable but (pause) there are some authorities who come out of it very badly Somerset and Avon (unclear) county councils are going to be abolished completely

Speaker 2:

aye

Speaker 3:

so it'll be coming down to (pause) sort of two or three I think it is unitary authorities

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

so there won't be a two tier local government at all

Speaker 2:

they just be done like sort of city level or

Speaker 3:

yeah (pause) but the general feeling is what they're doing may well be based on (pause) some realistic fact but it'll never pay for itself

Speaker 2:

mm

Speaker 3:

because the cost of doing it as we learnt from the last time we were all reboundaried and reorganized has still not been repaid

Speaker 2:

has it not well Tyne and Wear sort of lasted and then disappeared didn't it (interruption) I mean I remember

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

when I when I w I worked for Tyne and Wear in nineteen seventy five and I mean it was all (pause) publicized Tyne and Wear you know I mean we used to issue eh I used to get wronged because I used to call it Whine and Tear you know (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

all all all the people in the office who'd come up from the south mainly to you know to spread the gospel eh they they they were the amount of money they spent on publicity leaflets in the archives you know 'this is Tyne and Wear your archive' and the whole thing just disappeared didn't it

Speaker 3:

mind you we're not blameless (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

situation where I'm being given redundancy at the end of this year and the members of both parties have recently agreed to spend a hundred and thirty three thousand pounds on a new dining room for themselves ehm

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

gets under your collar a little bit

Speaker 2:

so when (unclear) do you actually go do you go on your birthday

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

which is December the

Speaker 3:

(unclear) glad (unclear) my friend (NAME) (NAME) does the costing system

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

for us whereby he eh operates a database which (pause) ehm as a result of us filling in a form every week attributes our costs to different (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

and he's just worked out recently that we actually spend only about a third of our time doing productive work (pause) the in thing now is things like B S fifty seven (unclear)

Speaker 2:

what is this this quality control (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

investment in people

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

staff are (unclear) (pause) and the impression I'm rapidly getting and everybody's slowly starting to agree with me is that we're spending more time (pause) ehm being introspective if you like

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

and standing in front of the mirror trying to make worselves

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

look better than we are actually out there

Speaker 2:

doing something

Speaker 3:

trying to do something for the

Speaker 2:

yeah that's (interruption) right yeah

Speaker 3:

(unclear) what is it the Council Charge payer now ehm and I feel a bit frustrated at having to spend so much time in sort of working parties and workshops and I've got training courses coming out of my ears some of them totally inconsequential (interruption) you know

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

ehm

Speaker 2:

is it everybody (unclear) speak to there's a bloke round the corner works in BT and he can not believe it and he's a manager or a senior manager in BT and he's trying to get out desperate desperately trying to get out and he's working and working you know at at at various ruses to get out ehm (pause) because he just says the whole thing's just gone mad all the things he does have got nothing to do with inst you know telephones or

Speaker 3:

mm

Speaker 2:

or communications

Speaker 3:

oh (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

and they send him on courses to make videos (interruption) and things like that it's absolutely barmy

Speaker 3:

well we (pause) we've had a new telephone system installed just in the last year (pause) it's good ehm but two things have happened one is that eh everybody is compulsorily to attend these telephone training courses

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

and apparently ehm the the one we were supposed to attend has actually now been cancelled four times in two weeks which of course is interrupting with all the work that I got scheduled because I've booked interviews with people and (unclear) meetings with people and I've got to keep changing them ehm and I gather from those people who've been there it's basically how to work the ehm the voice mail system which is more or less a an electronic answering machine built into the switchboard

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

the fact is

Speaker 2:

so you can leave a message on it

Speaker 3:

the fact is only key people have got access to it anyway

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

and then we've got this what is it the Citizen's (pause) Charter or (interruption) (unclear) whatever it is

Speaker 2:

oh right

Speaker 3:

which says that standards must be achieved whereby eh you answer calls within a (interruption) certain number of seconds (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh aye right and queries and and yeah (interruption) queries and (unclear)

Speaker 3:

and we can we we can divert our telephone calls so that ehm if I'm phoning you and you aren't there when you leave your office you press a couple of buttons which diverts all your calls

Speaker 2:

oh (interruption) right

Speaker 3:

to her over there

Speaker 2:

right right

Speaker 3:

the only trouble is she's probably diverted her calls to somebody else

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) so (interruption) what

Speaker 2:

it goes back

Speaker 3:

what actually happens is I

Speaker 2:

it goes back to you

Speaker 3:

I keep taking calls for our director

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

from people who have now paid for a call because it's been answered

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

and they're speaking to somebody who just can't help them at all

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

and all I can do is say 'I'm sorry I'll get him to ring you back'

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

surely you know if they left the system such that if the phone doesn't get answered after six rings you assume the person you want to talk to (interruption) isn't there

Speaker 2:

isn't there that's right

Speaker 3:

you put it down and you haven't paid for the phone call

Speaker 2:

(unclear) yeah

Speaker 3:

(unclear) seems you know

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

just because technology is there you've got to (interruption) use it

Speaker 2:

that's right that's right

Speaker 3:

or the other thing is every time they bring out a new version they've got to (unclear) and spend a thousand pounds (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

mm

Speaker 3:

ten thousand pounds or whatever just because the new version's come out we've got to have it

Speaker 2:

(unclear) yeah

Speaker 3:

and the old version everybody's just getting used to (laughter) working perfectly well

Speaker 2:

well it's like computers isn't it I mean you just (unclear) (unclear) I mean I'm slow at learning things so you just get used to one computer and then (unclear) say 'oh that's no good anymore we need this one' or

Speaker 3:

yes (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

'this this software package is what you should be using'

Speaker 3:

it's the software I don't mind changing computers and the better the machine they give me the better (unclear) better I'm pleased but I do object to just getting used to one piece of software and then being given another one because it's it's a different colour when it comes up on (interruption) the screen

Speaker 2:

(unclear) yeah

Speaker 3:

(unclear) very very little difference between that and the previous one and somebody's spent hundreds of (interruption) pounds on the upgrade

Speaker 2:

that's right yeah

Speaker 3:

then everybody's got to (interruption) start again learning another way

Speaker 2:

yes well we we we have we have Apple Macs and they put when we got them they had something called Pagemaker on it Aldus Page

Speaker 3:

Aldus Pagemaker

Speaker 2:

yeah which was I thought was canny no problem at all then one summer holiday I came back and there's only one computer in the school got Pagemaker on now and all the rest have got Clarisworks so I said 'well what happens to all my discs it's got Pagemaker' 'oh you can not use them' so I've got all (unclear)

Speaker 3:

yes

Speaker 2:

all these things on on on discs so they're useless

Speaker 3:

(unclear) when you buy an upgrade you must make sure that it's going to be compatible with the work that you've already done

Speaker 2:

it's hopeless isn't it so (pause) I mean really and and I mean I don't know how I think it's I think it's their ploy to keep themselves in a job because basically the I T staff if we get if we reach the level of competence they're at there's no they've got they've got no (pause) (interruption) purpose for being there have they

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

I mean the head keeps saying now you've got to do in service training

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

all staff should be able to use computers and they've obviously thought it out if all staff can use computers well (unclear) use them with their own kids so as soon as they think we're getting competent which for me takes ages they then think (unclear) we'll change the system

Speaker 3:

mm-hm (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

and they've got to keep coming asking questions and what he did they they got they got these Apple Macs and they got with each Apple Mac they got a they got a they got a book eh on how to use it right a big manual right and I saw them and I pinched one soon as I saw them and all the other ones have disappeared because the bloke over the I T (interruption) (unclear) in charge of I T

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

doesn't want the staff to get a hold of them now I I'm the only person apart from him in the school who's got one and I've got it here brought it home because I thought I'm going to keep it at home

Speaker 3:

yeah (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

and then I'll bring I'll bring a machine home in the summer holidays and I'll learn how to use this thing properly do databases properly and so on you know (pause) but I mean the whole thing's the whole thing's barmy and what really what really annoys me about computers is that we've got all this technology at school all the all the s all the school management is done on a system called SIMS which is Schools Integrated Management System

Speaker 3:

mm-hm

Speaker 2:

which is a high powered thing it'll do everything you know ehm all does all your budget and then it does it's linked to the Civic Centre as well because they control the (interruption) budget to a certain (unclear)

Speaker 3:

yes I've heard of it

Speaker 2:

but (pause) we're still writing reports by hand you know (unclear)

Speaker 3:

eh

Speaker 2:

put the name on the top and and (unclear)

Speaker 3:

well yeah (unclear) we got an assistant director of training

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

training and development and I would have thought he w should be the person really in the forefront

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

of using I T

Speaker 2:

yes

Speaker 3:

although his section doesn't actually teach I T but we do have that service provided by the computer department and he's still sitting at his desk with a little Grundig recorder and dictating stuff which somebody then has to audio type

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

and everybody else in the whole of our department is trying to encourage the rest of the county council to do

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

their own spreadsheets

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

databases and word processing and get into that office (unclear) we've got a network that covers

Speaker 2:

yeah

Speaker 3:

the entire county and the districts

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

it's a great network yeah (unclear) it works perfectly I'm still regretting the loss of my old machine in a way they've now finally given me a ehm a compatible machine which is networked but my old (unclear) the old freebie that we never paid for because it was it was given us on the back of the the first word processing package that we bought and that's now tucked away under a desk to be disposed of and there are two printers in the cupboard as well that nobody's ever going to use the only problem is there's no mechanism in County Hall

Speaker 2:

for getting rid of it

Speaker 3:

for actually disposing of it

Speaker 2:

mm-hm

Speaker 3:

it's got to go through a process which apparently takes anything up to a year through the auditors to get permission to put this thing up for sealed bids it has to be sealed bids

Speaker 2:

oh right right right yeah

Speaker 3:

and eh mine is carefully tucked away in the corner of our office because I want that when I leave

Speaker 2:

well I'll tell you what

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

there is a way round it because we've we've come across this I got a phone call about three weeks ago one of our governors is a councillor (NAME) (NAME) and he phoned the head and he said 'there's a model there's a there's a model in the engineers' department of the Civic Centre do you think (NAME) would want it' so the head ph rang me up and he said 'ring so and so in the city engineers and ask about this model' so I rang up (unclear) and I said eh 'I believe you've got a model of the Civic Centre' he (unclear) 'aye' he said 'do you want it' he said it was it was a it was a sort off like a design model for when when the Civic Centre was was being built and they were they were re planning the routes around it in the Haymarket and so on I said '(unclear) great (unclear) put it in the history room' you know and I said 'it's a talking point and the kids can look at it and do' (interruption) (unclear) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

and he said 'now' he (unclear) 'we've got a bit of a problem' he says 'we can not actually give you it' he said 'we have no mech mechanism for doing this'

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

he said 'well what we can do is we can give you it on p on a permanent loan' (pause) so I said 'that's all right by me' I said he said 'we don't want it back' he says 'believe me we'll never w'

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

'we'll never ever want it'

Speaker 3:

glad to see the back of it

Speaker 2:

(unclear) trying to get rid of it for months

Speaker 3:

sick of dusting it

Speaker 2:

so I went to Manchester last Tuesday had to go over to Manchester to the exam board and when I came back eh one of the department says 'I've got a bone to pick with you' I says 'what's the matter' he says 'well your model's come' 'oh' I says 'great'

Speaker 3:

mm-hm

Speaker 2:

I says 'where is it' he says 'well me and four caretakers carried it up the stairs'

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

I'm telling you it's as big as it's nearly as big as this room it must be about eight feet long and it's about four feet wide lot wider and it's in a great perspex cover you know it's a proper engineer's model

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

and actually it's interesting because it it's actually (pause) Dan Smith's dream it's it's the Civic Centre area and it's you know where they're going to have they were going to all the roads were going to go underneath (unclear) pedestrian walkways

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

and it's a proper engineer's model beautiful thing I mean it really is but I don't know what I'm going to I've got it stuck at the back of my classroom and I don't know what I'm going to do with it

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

took about took about five of them to get it up the stairs (laughter) the kids think it's great (unclear) come and look and eh one of them says 'is this the new school' I mean looked at the Civic Centre you know 'is this the new school' (pause) you know away with the fairies absolutely but that was it permanent loan that's that's what he said that's that's the way round it

Speaker 3:

mm-hm

Speaker 2:

so you (unclear) you just (unclear) (unclear) to you permanent loan either that or you just put in your bag and walk out with it that's probably the (pause) best way

Speaker 3:

I'll tell you the other thing that's suffering recently from (pause) cuts in the authorities as far as I'm aware I don't think we've got any Field Study Centres open (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear) wait a minute now hold on what what is the situation high (unclear) still exists now I think that's jointly now that used to belong to North Tyneside

Speaker 3:

yeah exactly I don't think any of ours exist (interruption) the ones that (unclear) used to use

Speaker 2:

eh Low Cranecleugh

Speaker 3:

Cranecleugh's still there (unclear)

Speaker 2:

still ah but that that that that belongs to the Calvert Trust I think I think Northumberland put some money into it now there is one somewhere where the devil is it

Speaker 3:

we've still got a a little section led by a guy who deals with

Speaker 2:

Ford

Speaker 3:

out door education

Speaker 2:

Ford Castle's still going

Speaker 3:

(unclear) of course (unclear) always go

Speaker 2:

ehm we sent kids to Ford Castle

Speaker 3:

we've just done an exercise on trying to market places like that and

Speaker 2:

Ford Castle

Speaker 3:

market some of the other ehm sort of stately piles during holiday times it's not easy

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

finding a suitable use

Speaker 2:

Ford Castle's fantastic I've had some canny weeks up there I mean compared with the other I mean like

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

you went to Allendale and you were in a you know in a converted (interruption) school

Speaker 3:

Allendale (laughter)

Speaker 2:

Catton converted school you know and it was grim (unclear) outdoor (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

oh I liked it there it was more like a village Ford to me is just like a picture postcard (unclear) I can't feel any atmosphere in it

Speaker 2:

oh there's there's nothing except Lady Waterford's paintings in the

Speaker 3:

mm

Speaker 2:

in the in the village hall or wherever they are (unclear)

Speaker 3:

and I still think back to you know your cottage fell in half

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

I can still see that crack up the end wall with (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 2:

that's right remember when we do you remember when we (unclear) we had to dig the (unclear)

Speaker 3:

I do

Speaker 2:

God we put some graft in there

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

you showed me how w w w w what method (unclear)

Speaker 3:

double digging or

Speaker 2:

double digging (unclear) what we did we kept we kept

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

I know we moved tons of earth from one (unclear) to the other

Speaker 3:

I know I had heartburn and a stinking hangover at the time and then the same afternoon you persuaded me try those flaming wheeled skis

Speaker 2:

(laughter) yes that's right were you were the only one who was daft enough to try them

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

nobody else would try them I certainly wasn't (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

oh we worked our way slowly up the hill all of us had a little go (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

you were the only one that came down

Speaker 3:

(unclear) and you like an idiot said go I'll buy you three pints at dinnertime if you go from the very top

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

I nearly killed myself

Speaker 2:

they were good I've never seen them since

Speaker 3:

just as well

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

I think I threw them in the river

Speaker 2:

aye that was that playing centre that was that was opposite (unclear)

Speaker 3:

God I landed right on the base of my spine at the bottom of the bank (pause) I think I could have done with a little professional instruction before (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) we had some canny we had some canny days up there but

Speaker 3:

(unclear) remember when we did get to the pub I tried to play darts and my eyes were still watering (interruption) (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter) aye

Speaker 3:

pardon me (pause) and then tearing the end of my thumb off with your air rifle

Speaker 2:

oh yes I remember that God aye did we have to take you to the hospital

Speaker 3:

you did I think we managed to get enough together to put some enough petrol in your Mini to get me to (interruption) Hexham General Hospital (unclear)

Speaker 2:

that's right Hexham Hexham Hospital that's right that was a sun it was a Sunday morning

Speaker 3:

it was early on Sunday morning just (unclear) (unclear) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

these things always happen at a weekend

Speaker 3:

yeah I'm accident prone I always have (unclear)

Speaker 2:

yeah well I remember you know Plankey Mill

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

I took some kids to Plankey Mill about two and a half years ago no about three years ago I think it was this time of year and they were camped at Plankey Mill and they were it was great they'd been smashing they'd done a walk pitch pitched their tents (pause) they were down by the river chucking stones in the water and I was making a c pot of tea I put my little stove (unclear) making a pot of tea and then there was a shout 'ah so and so's unconscious' great

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

and this idiot had been chucking bricks and this other idiot had walked in front of him and it had hit him right on the head boing but it was ten o'clock at night by the time I got there he wasn't unconscious he was all right you know but I thought well I can not let him go to sleep

Speaker 3:

no you've got to get him in (interruption) for a check

Speaker 2:

so I had to take him from there to Hexham hospital it was the same old thing you know and eh course there was nobody about because it was about half past eleven

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

quarter to twelve by the time we got there you know we had to rouse somebody up and then they had to send for the the doctor to come and have a look at him and they kept him in overnight and I had to ring his parents and this was all at twelve o'clock oh (pause) it does it makes it makes you wonder whether it's all worthwhile he was all right actually but I wasn't going to let him go to sleep I thought if he goes to sleep and

Speaker 3:

oh

Speaker 2:

he's he's not going to wake up

Speaker 3:

pays to have them checked

Speaker 2:

Hexham eh Hexham Hospital

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

yes I remember that with your air rifle aye that was eh

Speaker 3:

that's right (unclear) freezing cold I was waiting for you to get ready (unclear) my hands were absolutely numb I couldn't really feel anything with my finger tips I remember putting the pellet

Speaker 2:

in

Speaker 3:

in the breach

Speaker 2:

mm

Speaker 3:

and I think my coat button actually got

Speaker 2:

aye

Speaker 3:

caught in the

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

in the trigger guard and the barrel snapped up on the end of my thumb

Speaker 2:

oh aye (unclear) I remember there was a (interruption) lot of blood

Speaker 3:

(unclear) (pause) it was so cold I couldn't feel a thing (laughter)

Speaker 2:

there was a lot of

Speaker 3:

it was only halfway to Hexham (interruption) when it started to throb

Speaker 2:

(unclear) yeah what did they do did they put a stitch

Speaker 3:

I can still remember exactly what they did they said 'no we're not going to stitch it because it's torn we'll put Steri-Strip on' (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh right (interruption) yeah yeah

Speaker 3:

strips of adhesive just to pin it together (unclear) cleaned it out and

Speaker 2:

that was it

Speaker 3:

st I actually I've still got part of the mark somewhere I can never remember where it is

Speaker 2:

(unclear)

Speaker 3:

(unclear) so many other (pause) accidents since then it's probably been

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

totally covered up

Speaker 2:

I've got one little scar that I did when I tried model making a little scar there it was a like balsa wood you know and it was the same thing

Speaker 3:

I kept off that ever since I swallowed that ruddy pin

Speaker 2:

did you swallow a pin

Speaker 3:

did I never tell you that

Speaker 2:

no

Speaker 3:

(unclear) back when I was about twelve I did nothing else but model (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh I know you (unclear) a lot of model making

Speaker 3:

and ehm I was working in my bedroom when my mam and dad were out for a walk or something late one night and I discovered that this plastic tube was the exactly the same diameter as the heads of the modelling pins which was a little glass bead on the end (interruption) of the pin

Speaker 2:

oh yeah aye I know yeah I know right

Speaker 3:

and so it made a great pea shooter I had a bit of balsa wood hung up on the wall and was spitting these pins into the balsa wood and

Speaker 2:

oh

Speaker 3:

swallowed one didn't I

Speaker 2:

did you

Speaker 3:

I was somewhat worried when my parents came home the doctor was called and said 'well as long as it's not hurting it's not doing any damage' and then eh by the next morning I was in absolute agony it had got stuck and they had to come and there wasn't an ambulance available they sent a taxi and the taxi driver carried me out horizontal across his arms (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

couldn't move and apparently they used an electromagnet to move this pin into my appendix and then they took my appendix out to save doing it later

Speaker 2:

did they

Speaker 3:

yeah I've got a lovely scar on my tum

Speaker 2:

is that right so you never had appendicitis

Speaker 3:

(unclear) nobody ever asks to see my scar (unclear)

Speaker 2:

I'm not going to ask to see it

Speaker 3:

it was ehm (pause) one of the less glamorous (pause) parts of my aero modelling career

Speaker 2:

(laughter) (pause) I was never any good at modelling I was never any good at anything really

Speaker 3:

I never really got very far with it (unclear) although I used to love doing it ehm I didn't really have a lot a lot of money to spend on it

Speaker 2:

oh that's right

Speaker 3:

because (unclear)

Speaker 2:

it's like everything else

Speaker 3:

just me and my mum so other people had sort of three or four diesel engines

Speaker 2:

the engines aye oh I had a diesel engine once because I had to have one because everybody had them I g I got one second hand off somebody I never (unclear) a plane to put it in I remember sticking it in a vice and starting it you know thinking it was great because it went and it made a nice smell

Speaker 3:

oh I used to keep getting mine confiscated at school because I used to take it to school and sort of dismantle it during the lessons under the desks and put it together again (interruption) (unclear) flicking it over (unclear) (laughter)

Speaker 2:

probably more (pause) more u more use than most things we did at school I do remember (NAME) (NAME) making a it was bonfire Guy Fawkes time getting loads and loads of bangers and putting them into an ink (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

oh yes

Speaker 2:

and then he he used to then there was a there was a waste bin in in West Road yard and he put it in there and it it exp and set fire to it and they ex the bang was incredible

Speaker 3:

yes we did the s one weekend we did the same thing in my back garden

Speaker 2:

(interruption) highly dangerous

Speaker 3:

and the two of us would cut up about six bangers (unclear) actually made a rolled paper tube (pause) with (interruption) ordinary paper paste

Speaker 2:

mm

Speaker 3:

and let it set and filled it with the contents of six bangers plugged at one end with Plasticine and the we made a fuse out of match heads

Speaker 2:

right

Speaker 3:

crammed into a smaller tube and that was all sealed in with Plasticine

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

and here's me thinking that since I had a a fuse that long containing match heads that it would take perhaps three or four seconds to burn through (laughter) it didn't

Speaker 2:

did it not (laughter)

Speaker 3:

it left a hole about a foot deep in the back garden

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

how we got away with it (unclear)

Speaker 2:

it's amazing we survived isn't it (pause) did you ever go away with the school abroad

Speaker 3:

no

Speaker 2:

no no no I never did

Speaker 3:

I don't think that opportunity presented itself to very many people

Speaker 2:

no we had very

Speaker 3:

at that time (unclear)

Speaker 2:

very few trips the first time I went away with the school was in the fifth form we went to the Roman Wall

Speaker 3:

I

Speaker 2:

that was the only time I went

Speaker 3:

tell a lie I had one trip out with the school and that was ehm after the exams after the O levels they took us to Howdon Gasworks

Speaker 2:

oh I went to Howdon Gasworks that was in the six

Speaker 3:

gas and gas and coke works

Speaker 2:

aye that was in the sixth form I think I don't know why we went there

Speaker 3:

it was actually quite interesting (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

oh it was yeah the floor was red hot wasn't it

Speaker 3:

yeah (interruption) (unclear) that's right

Speaker 2:

you had to wear they had the men (unclear) shoes with great big soles

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

that was an interesting place to go yeah

Speaker 3:

(unclear)

Speaker 2:

(unclear) went to the Roman Wall but some of some of them went to Luxembourg in the fourth year and I was desperate to go and I was very very disappointed when I wasn't chosen (NAME) (NAME) went eh I wasn't allowed to (interruption) go

Speaker 3:

I think there were trips but there was a charge

Speaker 2:

oh there was a (interruption) charge

Speaker 3:

and and my eh my mother just couldn't

Speaker 2:

couldn't pay it aye

Speaker 3:

find enough to pay it

Speaker 2:

that's what puts people off now I mean we we took some kids to France three years ago and (pause) the problem is if you if you'd go on a cheap tour the accommodation was appalling I mean it was supposed to be in

Speaker 3:

mm

Speaker 2:

what they called eh like in a small hotel there was about five kids to a room it was scruffy the food was appalling it was awful

Speaker 3:

actually one of the things that annoyed me a little bit was (unclear) earlier on when (NAME) was young and we ehm we weren't possibly quite as well off as we are now ehm some kids who whose parents were on low incomes were getting trips to Field Study Centres and things

Speaker 2:

they were getting it if they were on free (interruption) school meals

Speaker 3:

virtually free

Speaker 2:

if they were on free school meals they would go free that's right (interruption) that was the rule

Speaker 3:

and ehm we were really pushing it to get (NAME) on these things (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

yeah because you're just on the border line yeah I know what you mean yeah

Speaker 3:

ehm (unclear) the fact that other other people (pause) were effectively get it for nothing

Speaker 2:

yes

Speaker 3:

and and we couldn't really afford for (NAME) to go it was

Speaker 2:

no

Speaker 3:

it was hard for (NAME) to bear (unclear) (pause) (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 2:

but that that was the cri that was the criterion that if you were on free school dinners

Speaker 3:

that's right

Speaker 2:

you went free

Speaker 3:

silly criterion really

Speaker 2:

well (interruption) (unclear)

Speaker 3:

I suppose it saves means testing twice

Speaker 2:

yeah (unclear) yeah

Speaker 3:

but there is a difference between the cost of a school dinner and the cost of a week away (laughter) (interruption) at a Field Study Centre

Speaker 2:

(laughter) that's right that's right that's right and I mean what we used to find when I worked in the Field Centres is some of the kids who were coming on free school dinners were coming with ten fifteen pound to spend (pause) (interruption) and the k

Speaker 3:

yeah and seventy five and seventy five pound trainers on yeah

Speaker 2:

that's right and the kids the kids who were actually who were being paid for had no spending money because their parents had to scrimp and save to send them

Speaker 3:

(laughter)

Speaker 2:

(unclear) much logic in it really (pause) I mean to be fair I mean we have we have kids at school who have ab absolutely nothing you know what I mean (unclear) you know I mean they are very very poor they just don't have a bean

Speaker 3:

yeah

Speaker 2:

you know what I mean they don't wear decent clothes they don't have anything eh they're pathetic really they've just got nothing nothing at all

Speaker 3:

so have we and my wife's going to want me to pick her up from work (pause) in half an hour

Speaker 2:

(unclear) we're coming I think we're coming to the end of our eh is that all right

Speaker 1:

mm-hm

Speaker 3:

are we qualified now we're hoarse (laughter)

Speaker 2:

(laughter)

Speaker 3:

page one sheet beetle metre I beat it gate paint fatal later I hate it eighty eight bet bent felt fettle better I met him hat ant battle batter drat it cart can't carter pot totter bottle font salt I got it caught daughter chortle (pause) haunt I bought it boat total motor I wrote it put footer put it in boot Bootle hooter bite title mitre pint bite it out fount outer pit bitter brittle print I hit it hilt beak wreck back I seek it I wreck it I back it sheet two bank lamp leap cap steep it leap it sorry lap it apron matron micro Metro leprosy petrol acrid atlas hopper butter hacker topple bottle hackle whisper custard after whisker doctor chapter jumper hunter bunker appear attend occur appearance attendance occurrence alpine altar polka staircase half past half cut automatic Jupiter epileptic sheet read breeze key gate made may boat load sheet three go boot brewed booze brew out loud cow sight side size sigh sighed knife five knives dive dial Friday diary I've got to do it tomorrow I had to put it off he meant what he said he's booking separate tables for supper a simple sentence pick up a packet of fire lighters pack it in or beat it he's putting it off he put in a bid jump up on the tractor he won't do that in a hurry put a comma in it which would have given me a chance to get a (interruption) breath

Speaker 2:

eet beetle metre I beat it gate paint fatal later I hate it eighty eight bet bent felt fettle better I met him hat ant battle batter drat it cart can't carter pot totter bottle font salt I got it caught daughter chortle haunt I bought it boat total motor I wrote it put footer put it in boot Bootle hooter bite title mitre pint bite it out fount outer pit bitter brittle print I hit it hilt beak wreck back I seek it I wreck it I back it (pause) bank lamp leap cap steep it lap it apron matron micro Metro leprosy petrol acrid atlas hopper butter hacker topple bottle hackle whisper custard after whisker doctor chapter jumper hunter bunker appear attend occur appearance attendance occurrence alpine altar polka staircase half past half cut automatic Jupiter epileptic sheet read breeze key gate made may boat load (pause) go boot brewed booze brew out loud cow sight side size sigh sighed knife five knives dive dial Friday diary I've got to do it tomorrow I had to put it off he meant what he said he's booking separate tables for supper a simple sentence pick up a packet of fire lighters pack it in or beat it he's putting it off he put in a bid (pause) jump up on the tractor he won't do that in a hurry put a comma in it

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