If you could just start off sort of whereabouts in South Shields were you born

Well erm I was born up at the Law Top and I've got me sister with me here today and she was there she was born in the same place and we had a brother (pause) now the Law Top is near the river of course (pause) and erm not far from the beach (pause) which we used to spend a lot of time down at the beach and we also used to go to open air swimming baths which they don't seem to have these days (pause) erm

Where was that was that (interruption) down

(interruption) That was dow- on the promenade in South Shields in the north side of the beach you know not the south beach and er the when the war started that changed everything 'cause I'm eighty-four now of course (pause) so (pause) when the erm when the swimming baths closed was when the war started (pause) now

was that because of the war or was it just coincidence that

(interruption) be- ca- ah well (pause) closed because of the war I would think what do you think (NAME)?

Yes well I mean nobody could get down there

you (interruption) couldn't go down there you see

(interruption) couldn't go down there you see and I think that was why

no that's right (pause) you see 'cause I mean they had all the beaches and that erm all (cough) wired off and everything didn't the-

There was lots of things

You see people in case the enemy came in by boat you know that was the reason

mm-mm

But as for South Shields changing a lot it has changed a lot and the town centre's changed a lot (pause) and well everywhere's changed the shops are different (pause) erm (pause) we didn't have the choice of food that you can get now when we were young (pause) erm so that's a big change but what we had was good (pause) and erm (pause) we -- we had corner shops where you could just pop in and get fresh stuff every day not to go to the er supermarket and em

There was no supermarket

there was no supermarkets then (pause) em I mean you had a chemist at your doorstep

That's right

you had a grocer

Green grocer

a green grocer (pause) and er the fruit- the green grocer and the chemist and the oh and the butcher the butcher and erm (pause) I mean we didn't know any other mind you know in them days and we were quite happy we didn't have much money because my father was out of work quite a lot and er (pause) but we never thought any more about it did we?

No no no no no we thought nothing about that we went to Sunday school

that's ri-

Every Sunday afternoon always on a Sunday never allowed out on a Sunday morning

No

No never

couldn't you couldn't do any knitting on a Sunday morning

couldn't read a paper

you couldn't read a paper (pause) and and our parents were young they weren't old Victorian you know they weren't 'cause er our parents were young when they had (interruption) us you know

(interruption) That's right

Go on then (NAME) do you want to say a bit

Well no I'm just saying we went to Sunday school every Sunday

And I was in the girl guides

mm-mm

And I was in erm (pause) in the I used to go to a Christian Endeavour meeting on a Monday night (pause) and em (pause) and they used to have what they called eh something to do with the Sunday School anniversary

mm-mm

where em you had a piece you had to learn this piece of like poetry I suppose it was and that it was for a certain Sunday and you were picked everybody didn't say a piece certain ones just picked but you (pause) 'cause you ge- got a new dress and new pair of shoes if you were going to be up on the stage so everybody wanted to be picked but you weren't you know however (pause) erm (pause) when I was talking about the corner shops I can remember we used to buy bruised fruit (pause) you know (pause) bruised fruit ehm they throw it away now the bruised fruit you know

Yeah you (interruption) did

(interruption) but we used to go (interruption) and buy

(interruption) A ha'penny

oh yes we did (laughter) we used to go with a ha'penny and buy some bruised fruit you see because (laughter) me mother and father probably couldn't afford to buy the proper stuff you know

Well that's it

(cough)

We didn't know any other

we didn't no and and er see we lived in a er back to back house the front door was in the front street and your back door was in the back lane (pause) and the back lanes everybody used to wash on a Monday (pause) and er our mother used to put her washing out put the washing line round her wall over to the next wall on the other side of the other streets you see and peg the washing out beautiful washing used to go out and then when the coal man came with the horse and cart they had to run out and bring all the washing in because he couldn't

(laughter)

he couldn't get up with his (interruption) horse and cart

(interruption) happy days

Couldn't get up with his horse and cart (pause) but em but you know my mother used to be already down in the wash house then and em washing from my father used to light the boiler in the wash house which was in the back yard before he went to work (pause) didn't he

I (interruption) was exactly the same as my mother

(interruption) and fill the

Yes I'm going to I'm going to (interruption) get uh-huh

(interruption) Go on then (NAME)

I used to fill he used to fill the boiler with water and then light the fire underneath (cough) and then

Seven o (interruption) clock

(interruption) then me mother used to be in the in the in the washhouse doing the washing (pause) em all day but cooking a dinner as well for dinner time twelve o'clock when he came in from work you know but you did exactly the same didn't you

I did exactly as my mother yes and em

You know more about it than me

Well the boiler used to be put on in the morning and it was just after seven o'clock I think I used to go in there in those days we had no washing machines everything was scrubbed and scrubbed and scrubbed and scrubbed and washed and scrubbed and then we had the boiler here the boil- all w clothes had to be boiled not woollens of course and em and I used to be there until about five o'clock in the winter I had candles lit in the wash house that's the truth mind you know (NAME) yes I did

mm-mm

And through the day when it was winter there was the three eldest and they weren't very old like them but they had to sit on what we called a cracket

Right

Then you know I mean they're well known crackets and they'd be sitting there with their woolly hats on and their scarves on round the fire

Wrapped up

Uh-huh while I was busy doing this washing and then erm not in the winter mind but the finer weather when I was finished that oh well I used to get the high chair out and give that a good scrubbing in the c- in the yard and then scrub all the yard down

mm-mm

Scrub it all down

mm-mm

I mean you know (interruption) you

(interruption) They were hard hard times

but they were happy times

Very happy

you know very happy

I mean I had enough washing of my own but the girl over the road when I was washing I would take her nappies and do them for her and she would do the same for me when she was washing

there were none of these plastic nappies you see in them days

That's right they didn't have them

(cough) they had to have terry towelling ones that you had to wash (cough)

(unclear) washed and boiled an em

But at least I know we had no money but we were happy and we felt safe not like you do these days you could leave your f- doors open you know

We could because we had no money (NAME) (laughter)

That's right (laughter) we had nothing to steal

We had nothing to steal you see so we lef- we could leave our doors open it didn't matter nobody would come in

But ano-

So you would've known quite a few people (pause) like you knew like you were saying you knew that woman you used to wash nappies with

Oh yes

So like you knew everyone

No well I don't know anybody up here now you know an- an- I mean they've moved away the people I only know that one woman over the road I don't know anybody else

Yes

But in them days you knew everybody you know and I mean another thing the nights were longer 'cause they hadn't changed the time like they've done over the years

That's right

and we used to be on the beach till eleven o'clock at night yes we did

My father had a fish and ch- well our father had a fish and chip shop

mm-mm

On the Law Top and they used to be up there until eleven o'clock at night getting (interruption) fish and chips to take back down to the beach

(interruption) Fish and chips tip down to the beach

And they had music going

Yes

Em gramophones what you wound up

Accordions

Accordion there would be a man with an accordion

Uh-huh

And the tents were up and they used to be dancing having their fish and chips and dancing and what have you till

Yes

midnight in fact

I mean you know I mean my father was out of work a lot you know but we didn't ever ever have any holidays (interruption) I think

(interruption) oh yes

We might have had a bus trip now and again

I don't even remember that (interruption) mind

(interruption) I think well I remember going to Ryton you know

Oh yes so did I

Uh-huh

On the (interruption) boat

(interruption) And I think we went with aunties I think it was

Uh-huh

with me father's sisters they weren't married and er they took us I remember but er up to Ryton and we thought that was great (laughter) you know other people were probably going abroad I don't know

About a half a mile up the Tyne I think

but but we only knew the other people that you know hadn't any money

So how old would you have been when you were going to Ryton? Was that

How old would we be?

Would you have been quite little?

Oh yes we'd be about eight or nine or something like (interruption) that you know

(interruption) that's right that would be about right

You see I mean eh there was a lot of eh wealthy people where we lived you know but they lived in the bigger houses they were Tyne pilots (pause) and eh (cough) they always had plenty money and there was eh a couple of em undertakers lived in nice houses

There was doctors

doctors that's right

School teachers

Yes uh-huh

I mean I remember Miss (NAME) she lived (interruption) i-

(interruption) Yes she did she lived in one of the avenues

Yes

And eh

(interruption) There was something else

(interruption) But I still a- I mean I we left the Law Top when I was about fourteen I think if you class ol- Roman Road the Law Top

Yes you c- well you could but em no I (interruption) was

(interruption) How old were you when

I was fifteen when we left Roman Road

And how long did we live in Roman Road?

Well not a lot of years (pause) not a lot of years em lets say what about

Two year?

Oh no a little bit (interruption) lon-

(interruption) Longer than that?

Uh-huh

About four year then?

Oh yes I would say about that

Well we

We pro- well probably left at the I would be em (pause) I don't know how old I would be when I left probably about twelve or something I don't know but we moved to Roman Road now that was off Ocean Road and eh if you walked right along to Ocean Road we used to go along there 'cause we used to love the fairground you know

Was that not sort of King street end (interruption) like the

(interruption) No that's the other end

(interruption) That's right th- to the wat-

(interruption) Where the parks are

That's right along there and I mean in the parks I mean I used to love the r- the eh north marine park not so much the south marine but we used to like 'cause there was always a band used to play in the south marine on a Sunday night in the south marine park a brass band you know and we used to like to go there but eh in the north marine park it had a lot of little coves didn't it?

Yes it was nice in there

And we used to love the park

mm-mm

And eh but we used to like to go to the fairgro- we never had much money to spend there but we used to like to go you know I think we liked the lads that were on the fairground you know

We probably did

Yes so (pause) but em then we moved up to Westoe and off Stanhope Road

mm-mm

And then em (pause) yes that's right

That's right

And then I got ma- you got married first you (interruption) (unclear)

(interruption) Well I went to the WAF first

You tell him about the WAF then

Uh-huh then I went into the RAF I was only seventeen and a half and I was in there for three year (pause) and er well I really I can talk about it but I mean it was just the RAF you know and I was a driver in the RAF

Right

And em and you know we talk about different people well like I think I said before (NAME) (NAME) that was his name and erm he was always on the wireless we didn't have television then of course and em and he was going his mother apparently lived in Rothbury well I was em stationed at RAF Acklington and that's where he landed and I had to take him from there by car up to Rothbury to his mothers so that was something I thought oh this is lovely (interruption) you know (laughter)

(interruption) There see

Oh lovely I know somebody and em and then I came out mind I'd driven everything I think when I was in there I've driven a single decker bus ambulance em not the fire engine mind nothing like that but eh and all the cars and wagons and all the three tonne lorries as there were then they're bigger now the lorries of course

Yeah

But em and I I did enjoy my time in the WAF mm-mm I really did and then I got married and that er (laughter) and that was the end of that (laughter)

Without her parents wishes she got married

Oh yes uh-huh yes

She came home on leave and brought her boyfriend with her and they wanted to get married and they said 'no'

That's right

You have to wait em wait till your next leave and then we'll see about it

mm-mm

Well I think they went back and just got a special licence to get married and said 'oh we're going to get married' they came home like

Oh no I went to no no no

No what happened then?

I went to St. Mary's Church we had to go to St. Mary's Church to get the licence and everything oh no

Oh well you must've said you wanted to be

Uh-huh yes

Well my mother and father could do nothing abo- my mother and father could do nothing about it

Uh-huh oh I don't know about that

Yes because I think you'd got special leave from the RAF to get married (pause) and that's why they couldn't do anything about it or they thought they couldn't anyway you know the- ee the sho- we'd better let her get married you know however (pause) em (pause) yes and so that was the end of her you know

mm-mm yes so that was it there and then I told you about the rest when I got married and doing all the washing and what having ye and then I had five children so I was quite busy

(laughter)

Yes you're right

Busy in the house and we didn't have much holiday either so (pause) but as I say we still enjoyed life and we still went down to the beach even when I had mine you know I used to take them all down to the beach and (pause) yes but they were always all right

Yes

And we enjoyed we life really in all honesty we didn't know any other did we?

We didn't no we didn't

We didn't know any other we enjoyed what we did

That's

That was our way of life

It was

And to be quite honest I think we liked it better then than what we do now

Well ye d-

When you see some of it now

I mean we could go out during the war in the blackout you know everything in the d- in night time just with a torch in the blackout

mm-mm

Because black dark it was

(interruption) No lights on no shop lights

(interruption) No lights no lights anywhere

Not a light

But we used to go out but I mean you had a torch to help ye you know to fin- well I mean oh where's oh I was going to say where's the dog

He's here it's all right

And em but I mean eh you know so there was a lot to be thankful for in them days you know rather than eh frighten- I mean I wouldn't dare go out now I'm far too old not that there's anywhere for me to go at night time really and em

Well not now

Not now (interruption) not now

(interruption) (laughter)

Well I could go to bingo I suppose (interruption) if I wanted to

(interruption) Oh right

You know but I'm not interested so em so there you are

Did you play much bingo then did you?

I never went to bingo she did

No I used to go to bingo

She used to like bingo didn't ye?

Oh I used to love bingo I used to go twice a week with my cousin

mm-mm

And em every and a friend every Sunday and Tuesday night and the most I won I shouted for was two thousand three hundred and that shared between the three of we you know

mind

But we were pretty lucky

mind you she's always been a gambler

(laughter)

I haven't I wouldn't pay the money for bingo to (interruption) lose it no way

(interruption) She was plain you see

I was but she was like my father because my father while he didn't back horses a lot he would have a a gamble on a special race didn't he?

mm-mm yes

And eh I mean you were a bit like that you know my father used to like to go to bingo with (NAME) on a Monday afternoon (interruption) you used to go you know

(interruption) Yes (unclear)

Uh-huh and eh but eh apart from that but I was too mean no I wouldn't spend the money (pause) so there you are (pause) but eh times have changed dramatically so I don't know what they're going to be like in a few years time when we're not around you know

Yes but happy days that's for sure they were really (pause) yes and er so I don't know I think we've just worked from then after w- the children were grown up I think they've (interruption) worked ever since haven't they?

(interruption) Well that's right you worked when you left school you went to work

Hamlins

To Hamlins

I was fourteen

At a grocer's shop that's right

For four and ninepence a week

Four and ninepence

A penny off fifty pence

mm-mm (interruption) (unclear)

(interruption) And that's what I got and I worked from half past eight in the morning till erm seven o'clock at night (pause) half day Wednesday (pause) eight o'clock on a Friday and I think it was later on a Saturday

Nine o'clock probably (pause) that's when the shops used to close

That's right (interruption) yeah

(interruption) Croftons and then nine o'clock on a

(interruption) Nine o'clock yes

(interruption) clock on a Saturday the shops used to close

And that was for four and ninepence a week

And that was groceries?

(interruption) Groceries

(interruption) Uh-huh

Uh-huh yes

Yes

Now I didn't I yes I left school to go to look after a little girl

mm-mm

And em (pause) she was four I think wasn- what did they call her?

(interruption) (NAME)

(interruption) (NAME)

That's right and eh 'cause my aunt worked for them my fathe- my mother's brother worked for these people and they had a business a croo- a a confectioning business and eh so I went to look after the little girl now when she went to school a- sh- I mean I did still look after her a bit but em they asked me to go into the shop (pause) well I went into their bakers shop for a little while and then I left and I went to a big firm you know a big shop

Yeah

So I worked in the shop and em (pause) trying to think oh and then during the war you went into the WAF and I went to work in the factories

Ammunitions

Ammunitions that's right (pause) I had a friend who I'd been to school with and I'd always been friendly with her and she worked for Ware's who was a big firm in Shields er you sold lovely stuff nice em silverware and em (interruption) glassware

(interruption) Everything really

(interruption) You know and em she'd got the sack because she'd made an error over somebody getting a purse monogrammed you know what I mean? And er so of course once you went onto the dole well they would put ye into munitions or do something for the war effort you see so she didn't want to go on her own so she came up to my house ah when we lived at Westoe and me mother and she asked me would I go with her so I didn't want to go into the forces she did but I didn't so I thought oh well I'll go with (NAME) and her and I went down to em to Crewe and em tom- thought we'd make we fortune which you did you know I mean you did (interruption) get money

(interruption) Oh they had good money then

Yes they had good money (interruption) then and

(interruption) Course it was

Em I was there I think a couple of year but I didn't like it I was homesick and em (pause) so I applied to get a (pause) em discharge and I had to have an examination (pause) and er they said I had a bad chest and er anyhow I came home so I got discharged from that and soon as I went to the dole and I said 'well I can't go back again because I've got a dis- had a discharge from this factory' so they said 'well we're going to send you to' and it was a Dr (NAME) I remember to get examined again you see I went to see Dr (NAME) he says there's nothing wrong with me chest so I had to do something so I went into the (pause) I went into em the NAAFI you see well I

What was that sorry?

The NAAFI well it was it now oh (NAME) what do they call it? (pause) it was for the forces you know it's like em

It was the Navy (interruption) Army Air Force Institute

(interruption) Army Air Force. Uh-huh that's right

That's what it was

And it was like a shop you see and er when I got there there was fires I don- I can't remember why the fires were there but I had to clean the fires out well I'd gone to work in the shop (pause) and er and I always remember it was a woman I was in a- above me who lived in Shields now I know her I still know her by sight you know and she was like me boss and I she made me had to do these well I think I was only in three or four days when I packed it up and I came home so then I had to go back again and they sent me to Manchester to work in another factory you know and then by then not long after that the war finished so I was back home again so

And she was pleased about that

I was yes er

Eh my goodness (pause) yes so

Oh I certainly didn't er like being away from home

Oh no

However never mind

I didn't mind though no (interruption) I enjoyed it

(interruption) No you enjoyed it didn't ye yes

Then you see you had a daughter went into the air force

Yes our (NAME)

That's right

She did exactly the same

But there you are (NAME)

So could you tell the difference sort of living down in Manchester and Crewe and back here like even like in the war back then was there a massive difference or was it

Well (pause) well I think b- no it was different because there was (unclear) starting to get more money you see because I was making money and y- you know I didn- you see it was nineteen thirt- you see I'm talking about when I was a little girl I was born nineteen twenty three well I mean em when I was me father was out of work and up till (pause) up till nineteen thirty three I would be ten then when me father took the fish shop over

Fish shop mm-mm

And that meant we were a little bit better off you see and then of course by nineteen thirty nine the war started well things were getting better for everybody you know and em course I start to make a bit of money so things

And my father had to go into the ship yards

Yes that's right

You see he was a plater by trade

Uh-huh

So that everybody ha- was into work then you see so and you were just saying you were earning a bit money

Yes so I just em (pause) I em (pause) things were much better I mean there's a lot more stuff about as well you know

mm-mm course there was

Because they'd been scarce you couldn't buy this that and the other erm

We were on rations

Rations you see we were on rations we used to have ration books

I think one egg a week or something

That's right

Two ounces of (interruption) bacon

(interruption) You never saw a banana

Oh I never saw a banana (interruption) never ever

(interruption) Nah no but

I don't think we knew what bananas were did we then?

No no we never saw

(laughter)

But the rations were very scarce you know very poor

Very poor

But

(interruption) Four ounces of

(interruption) And me mother and you know and me mother wasn't the only one but they had to go out early morning to queue if they knew the butcher was getting some meat in you know or the fish monger (interruption) you know

(interruption) That's right

They had to go out early in the morning to queue to get it

Even if it was only for a bit sausage

Sausage that's right yes

Terrible when (interruption) you think about it

(interruption) Ee terrible when ye think about it

Oh yes my mother used to stand for hours I think in the queue

Oh she did she did but you see in them days there was no fancy cream cakes and fresh cream anyway there was cake -- cream cakes but they were synthetic cream and there wasn't the choice that you've got now you see I mean we had a wh- dinner made every day of the week didn't we (interruption) cooked dinner

(interruption) Oh every day well I did for my family

You see well this is it that's right we couldn't afford to spend money on luxuries (interruption) you know

(interruption) No

And em (pause) and I mean the oven course the ovens were better 'cause you cooked by coal fire and I mean the oven was at the side of the er the fire place and em (pause) eh so the oven the oven was always hot you didn't have to go and turn it on it was always hot 'cause you had a fire on and eh you co- you so you could just push your dinner in there you know whatever you wanted you know

Yep

And em (pause) but there you are I mean eh we survived it and I mean when you think I'm eighty four and me mother was ninety two nearly and me father nearly ninety one and they'd (interruption) been bought

(interruption) No my mother was nearly ninety (interruption) three

(interruption) Uh-huh that's right

And my father nearly ninety two that's right

So em

And look at we aunts my father's sisters

Yes that's (interruption) right

(interruption) One was ninety wasn't she?

Yes yes

The other one ninety eight

Uh-huh yes

So we're creeping up (laughter)

Eeh dear

(laughter) Ah dear yes (pause) ah yes there's em (pause) happy days though

Well there's a lot to be thankful for you know I mean there's a lot of things are much nicer now than what they were when we were younger I'm not going to say I mean we're much cleaner in oursel- we only had a bath once a week that's all you got bathed once a week now

That was in a tinned bath

Tinned bath in front of the fire you know I mean you didn't change your underwear like you do everyday 'cause you didn't have it to change with you know you might as I can't remember now but

Probably once a week

(laughter) Oh probably once

No I think it might've been maybe (interruption) twice

(interruption) Twice a week

Or three times maybe

Uh-huh I don't think it was three times mind it might've been (interruption) twice a week

(interruption) twice

But I mean you c- you never change your clothes you see (pause) and I mean em

We hadn't any to change (interruption) into

(interruption) Well you didn't have them you see 'cause they couldn't afford them we had two er me father's mother was the widow 'cause his dad died when he was two but the he had two sisters who had never been married (pause) and they were at home one worked and the other one was em

(interruption) Stayed at home

(interruption) Stayed at home to help the mother 'cause he had five brothers you see and em we used to em they were very good to us these two old aunts who always bought us our new clothes for Easter you always got new clothes at Easter or in the winter they would buy us a new coat they used to get them made as they used to make them

But they we had we had coats for

(cough)

Sundays

Uh-huh

Well clothes for Sunday and clothes for week for the (interruption) school

(interruption) Yes that's (interruption) right uh-huh

(interruption) And that's what we had

Yes

And that was through our aunts

But em

Oh no they were very good to us

Yes they but it hadn't been for them I mean we would've been me mother's mother didn't bother so much about us

No

I mean she probably didn't have the money I don't know well she had nobody at home to help her I suppose but I mean me father's sisters were a- weren't married you see so they helped out a (interruption) lot you know

(interruption) (unclear)

And er if there was ever a box of cho- you know I was always the favourite (laughter) because I was always poorly you know (laughter) and I mean mind she had me Aunty (NAME) to stick up for her 'cause she used to say 'our poor (NAME) she always gets left out you see and everything's for our (NAME)' you see but anyhow em she used to em (pause) I was going to tell you something you see and it's all gone now it's all about (pause) but everything was with

Chocolates box of chocolates

Boxes of chocolates everything was for our (NAME) you know I think that was it I think she probably got the ribbon off the box of chocolates (laughter) you know what I mean

That'd be nice (NAME) wouldn't it a

I'd probably give her half

Because she was she was bad every (interruption) year

(interruption) year I was

Every winter

I was really poorly

You didn't si- you had pneumonia every

I did

Every winter

Uh-huh yes every winter I got pneumonia uh-huh

So she was never round playing or

No she had to help me and it -- when we lived in the back to back houses we use- have a big step outside the back door into the back lane you see and er it was quite a high step wasn't it? (interruption) Can you remember?

(interruption) Oh yes it was

And I got a doll's pram this year you see I don't know if it was for Christmas or what but it was quite a big pram actually you know

They were then

They were in them days for children you know for a doll's pram and I could never manage it you know I could never get it ou- I wanted to be in the back lane I couldn't get it out (laughter) I wasn't strong enough I had to get her to come to do it

My mother used to say '(NAME) go and help her with the pram'

(laughter)

Ye-

She did that's the truth

Uh-huh

And so I says 'get out the way' lift it up

Oh I

I had to go and bring it in she wasn't strong enough

No I wasn't strong enough you see and I think you know and another thing I probably was jealous of her for some reason because em when we used to go to our grandmothers on a Sunday (cough) we always went in the back door because the back door was nearer

Where we (interruption) were

(interruption) were see

Or we'd have to go round the corner

Otherwise we would've had to go in round the corner so we always go in the back door and we used to run down the back lane and she was always better (laughter) runner you see and I pushed her

She pushed us and that's what I've got (NAME)

And she's got a mark on her forehead

Oh I can see it

Uh-huh

All split open

All split open with me

She'd s- she'd pushed us up (interruption) against

(interruption) To stop her up against a brick wall and split her head open you know (laughter) I was wicked wasn't I?

Oh what a terrible (interruption) person

(interruption) And you would never have thought it you know would ye?

(laughter)

(cough)

So they're some of we happy days eh

Yes

Ee yes (pause) oh yes but we went there every Sunday for we tea our (interruption) Grandmothers

(interruption) Yes that's right

On a Sunday mm-mm after after Sunday school

Uh-huh

We ha- we used to go through the park didn't we?

Yes

And then er we used to go to my Grandmother's and we got probably a ha'penny each

(interruption) We used to get

(interruption) We used to go to the little sweet shop the corner shop

Uh-huh

And ge- buy some dolly (interruption) mixtures

(interruption) mixtures

Something like er

Chocolate drops

Chocolate drops come back and we had a cup and a spoon and that was your scales you know and you'd be selling the sweets you see (laughter) when the when the spoon went down that was it (laughter)

And we had two cousins who lived up Stanhope Road quite a way from where the Law Top from my grandmothers and eh they used to come and they used to come down two boys they were (NAME) (interruption) and (NAME)

(interruption) (NAME)

(NAME) they called him then (cough) and they used to come down on a Sunday (pause) and after din- it was only a two roomed flat you know my grandmother used to be in the bedr- on a Sunday afternoon in bed we were in this living room carried all the water up the yard was no water in the house they had to go down for every drop of water down the yard with the dish a pan or a kettle and there was only a little cubby hole wasn't it?

Yeah mm-mm

And we used to go every Sunday for our tea I can't remember what we got now but and (NAME) and (NAME) used to come down and after tea the tea things got cleared away and we used to have a concert (laughter) and we all had our songs to sing she would sing em ee I've forgotten

Roman in (interruption) the Gloamin with

(interruption) Oh Roman in the Gloamin

The bonny

Our (NAME) would sing cockles and muscles or was that (NAME)?

No now those two together used to sing 'where ha yee been aal the day Billy (interruption) boy Billy boy

(interruption) Oh that's right that's right (cough)

(interruption) What did you used to sing?

(interruption) And I used to sing Betty Cohern

That's right Betty Cohern's got lips that this is her (interruption) kicking her height

(interruption) Be-

Yes Betty Cohen has lips like red (unclear) roses

Yes but we (interruption) all

(interruption) Oh

had to do we party piece our Grandmother had had us a little sleep and then she would be sat in her chair and she'd be there and we were sort of in a corner

Uh-huh

You know you used to stand in a corner and er she used to sit there and oh she loved it (interruption) didn't she?

(interruption) Oh she did uh-huh

She loved (interruption) it

(interruption) So as I say I mean I know times were hard but we had some happy times you know what I mean

mm-mm we knew how to play

Uh-huh that's right we did

Yes and we knew how to enjoy we self in our own way

Uh-huh

We didn't have we didn't ha- a lot of toys or anything like that

No no we didn't

Nothing like they are today

No

But we could make some- you know something of we life as then you know to do what we wanted to do to make we happy you know (interruption) erm

(interruption) Yes

It didn't take much (interruption) t-

(interruption) To t-

To make we happy

No it didn't

It didn't and (interruption) (unclear)

(interruption) And they used to all go roun- grandmother had a parrot

Oh yes

And eh it used to say 'whsst whsst' er

Wisht there's the door

There's the door he used to say this is what he used to do and then if you were to give it a wh- a matchstick and it would put it in it's p- er mouth

Beak

er beak and it used to sang a song it used to dance you know

We used to go dow de dow de dow (interruption) de dow

(interruption) this used t-

And it was dancing (interruption) along

(interruption) Used to dance along I'm

And my auntie was always calling it

Uh-huh

One of my aunties

Yes that's

Always 'oh shut up' and all this kind of thing

Uh-huh

Till this day it was got out and went straight for her and bit her on the neck

(laughter)

It did

(laughter)

It did but it a really I think it I don't know if it belonged to an old uncle that lived with them as well

mm-mm

He lived between the grandmoth- it was his mother was his brother he were sister and brother you see and uncle (NAME) wasn't married eh but I think he lived with a woman and I think when he fell out with this woman he used to come to our grandmother's and stay there you see and then I think the parrot belonged to him 'cause he could get it to do all sorts of things couldn't he uncle (NAME)?

Well he could but you know I remember you know and I going with my father for the parrot when (interruption) he was

(interruption) Can ye?

Yes and it was through my uncle (NAME)

Oh was it?

Yes and I tell you what I don't know where they live now but it was not Erskine Road but up kind of (interruption) somewhere

(interruption) Up

(interruption) Around there

(interruption) Up there that's right

Up there

Uh-huh

And I went with my father

Oh to get the (interruption) parrot

(interruption) To get the parrot

Oh well maybe it was it didn't belong to him you know

So well it was uncle (NAME) it w- up- erm my uncle (NAME)'s was at this house the parrot his parrot I don't know but I know we I went with him

Uh-huh

To get the parrot

Uh-huh

Uh-huh

But there you are (NAME)

Mm-mm

(cough)

So that one of a sort of would he say like quite a bit or

The parrot?

Yes sorry (laughter)

Yes

Erm I don't think it s- it spoke

It did say some things (interruption) (NAME) yes

(interruption) Did it oh it'd be very little though it wasn't like what you'd hear the parrots (interruption) now

(interruption) I don't think anybody

(unclear)

Anything bothered bothered about it you know

Oh it liked to just it liked to you know when it was dancing the the erm matchstick was going back and forth (interruption) wasn't it (NAME)?

(interruption) Yes uh-huh (cough)

Uh-huh oh and it was dancing (interruption) a long

(interruption) Uh-huh

Backwards and forwards along (interruption) the

(interruption) But we didn't take much notice of it actually

No we never bothered

I think it because it I mean if it was now I would sort of be more interested in it but I think because we were kids it was always there you know the parrot was always there

Uh-huh and we didn't know that it would talk if (interruption) you talk

(interruption) Talk no

To it you know we didn't know (interruption) anything

(interruption) We-

About them

And you see I mean em while I'm not fussy about (NAME) (pause) because we've never had my mother and father we once had a dog it was a stray but it wasn't with us very long

No it was (interruption) a collie

(interruption) but we but Uh-huh but my father had been brought up with a dog you see and my aunties and cats you know one time they used to have five cats you know and they've had a parrot and I don't know what else they didn't have you know and so I was I was thinking maybe that's where em I thou- I thought our (NAME) might have picked it up from me through my aunties you know liking animals you know but there you are he didn't so (pause) yes there you are

Yes so that's our (laughter)

(laughter)

His -- well part of it I suppose

Part of it yes

Yes I suppose the I think you're getting all the good sides of it you know

All the good stuff

Well if you can call it good stuff you know I mean erm (pause) well we didn't think anything abo- when I think about washing and what have ye and

No

I mean nobody thought anything of it washing in those days

That's right no they didn't everybody was in the same there was only a certain few who had money that er you see now you (NAME) (NAME)' father what was he -- what was (pause) he -- a

(interruption) Oh he was a river policeman

(interruption) (unclear)

River police you see people who had good jobs they they wouldn't have lived like we lived you know they would have er all the the (interruption) modern things

(interruption) But we played with them they all played with them

(interruption) Oh yes uh-huh

(interruption) We went to their house and

Uh-huh that's right

Didn't say that they had money that they didn't want to know us you know like some of them are now really erm but we all played together

Yes

You know look at the friends (interruption) who

(interruption) And I mean well that's right and another thing I mean while my mother and father didn't we weren't allowed just to run riot (interruption) not by any means

(interruption) Oh no

We were brought up properly we couldn't stand on a chair with your shoes on you'd have got into trouble (pause) or em I'm just trying to think of different things where we're not not allowed well we c- couldn't knit on a Sunday couldn't read the papers

That's right that's what I'm saying

Uh-huh and er that's right we've already said about that

That's right we weren't allowed out to anything on a Sunday apart (interruption) from

(interruption) No couldn't play out

You weren't ready in fact I don't think on a Sunday (pause) er you got ready properly after (interruption) your dinner didn't ye?

(interruption) That's right yes to go to (interruption) Sunday School yes that's right

(interruption) Sunday school

Yes in all your clothes

But er but we weren't just dragged up (interruption) you know what I mean

(interruption) Oh no

We (interruption) were brought up

(interruption) And we had to ask to leave the table

Table yes you couldn't

We could n (interruption) ever

(interruption) Never

Leave the table

And you couldn't speak with your mouth full that was (interruption) another

(interruption) No

Thing you couldn't do

And always please or thank you or else you were in trouble

Yes so I mean not like some of them these days who just do what they like

Yes

But we weren't allowed to do that even though we had no money we were still brought up properly

Yes

But however

Well we were clean and that's what I mean there's no harm in being poor I suppose (interruption) even today

(interruption) No that's right

You know but you can be clean

But er I mean it was wasn't until we got older that we got jobs ourselves that we started to get all these modern things you know what I mean no washing in the wash house any more you know

Of course

And getting a w- just a thing like this do what do they call them types of washers that you swill back and forwards?

I -- uh-huh well you'd had (interruption) a one didn't ye?

(interruption) I had a one

And I'd had a one I got one off my aunties I think

That's right yes

But al- washers

Uh-huh uh-huh

And it was (interruption) all

(interruption) You did it by hand

That's right you did it by hand and there was (pause) (interruption) er the thing insi-

(interruption) Wasn't electric

Wasn't electric there was like a big thing on the bottom that I don't know what you would say it was and it had em it went like that up and down you know (NAME) with pieces in the middle (pause) er missing I mean and that's how you did it back and forwards didn't ye (NAME)?

Yes that's right

Back and forwards

Uh-huh

(interruption) (unclear)

(interruption) But I tell ye something (NAME) you erm (pause) er (pause) you had when you washed in the wash house you had a wooden tub and a poss stick

Nana did

Uh-huh

(interruption) My mother had

(interruption) And er did you have a -- a ani- num- ninum tub did ye?

Yes

And a -- and a zinc well a zinc tub and a zinc washer a po- a washer no wh- posher

Posser posser

Posser posser that's right but my mother had em a wooden tub and a won- it was (laughter) heavy as could be you know this w- how she lifted it across the the (interruption) it was a-

(interruption) And

It was about that broad down the bottom and there was like a stem a wooden stem with a handle on like that and this thing was c- in like four pieces this this bottom thing was about that deep it was in like four pieces of wood you know what I mean?

It was all joined (interruption) together

(interruption) gether uh-huh but you know and you had to do the I mean how she it was as heavy as could be how she ever did it I don't know but

And the ringer as they (interruption) called it

(interruption) With a mangle

It was all hers the ringer it was a mangle and it was wood

Wo- wooden (interruption) roller

(interruption) Rollers

(interruption) And big

(interruption) You had to turn the big wheel

A big thick rollers (interruption) you know

(interruption) Uh-huh

To get it the water out your (interruption) clothes

(interruption) Yes

When you're putting it through the mangle to get the water out you know

And the wheel I'm saying the wheel was (interruption) bad enough

(interruption) Bad

Wasn't it?

It

(laughter) You had to turn it

Eeh dear me

Eh I don't know (pause) but she was up and down stairs and it was on a Monday she used to er whenever we were little she's always er cooked the bread baked bread

Yes uh-huh

And tea cakes on a Monday

Mm-mm

And that was with and she was washing as well

well mm-mm (pause) that's why she was down there all day 'cause we didn't have the clothes that we've got now you see (cough)

Why no you see

That's how she was down there in the washer 'cause the washing wasn't getting done while she was upstairs doing all this baking and cooking (cough)

Yes ee

Ooh this is going to sound terrible with coughing

Eh?

It sounds terrible with coughing

Do you want a mint?

No no I'm all right now

Do you want to go and get a glass of water?

No thanks I think is that it is that enough?

Er (pause) another couple of minutes

Another couple of minutes? Yes

Uh-huh so well I'm just trying to think if I can think of anything else what what we've been up to

I mean even just on the photographs there (pause) any shops or anything

Are you what love?

Shops or anything like I know you said that what was that one on the corner?

Yes Croftons now that was my mother's that was my aunt used to work in Croftons

And they worked a year for nothing at Croftons that was a big store that and they worked a full year before they got any money whatsoever

Did they?

(interruption) Yes

(interruption) No I didn't know that

My mother told me that

Oh well there you are

They worked a year for nothing

Oh and of course this is the ferry which we used to like to go on the I used to like to go on the ferry mind

I used to always go on the fe- I was on the ferry every day at one time 'cause I worked over in Tynemouth then I worked in Cullercoats (pause) and I used to travel on the ferry every day (interruption) to get to

(interruption) You know you know em when er when (NAME) was er a young boy you know was working serving his time

Uh-huh

He was em (pause) they used to take it they used to go down to they used to have to go to North Shields and they had to wheel a big wheel barrow you don't see wheelbarrows nowadays you know big ones wooden ones and er they used to wheel the w- barrow down to the ferry get onto the ferry when you get to the other side I don't know if you've been across on the ferry uh-huh

Yes

And you had to push it up Borough bank

Up the the big one?

The big bank uh-huh had to push it up there to wherever they were going to do a job now you know can you see them doing it these days?

No

They don't you see they've got vans you know

That's right but you see they don't have any there's no cars now on the ferry now and things

No no it's just

There's nothing now there's only passengers you know

Yes uh-huh that's right

When I used to travel in the morning and then come back at night they had em there was wagons on there and cars and was packed

Yes

You had to go downstairs out the way

That's right

Mm-mm

I think didn't they used to let the cars on first on the ferry?

That's right uh-huh

Yes and then the passengers followed y- (interruption) you know

(interruption) That's right

That's right I remember that

Yes

But em but when I think about it now you know they had to do all that with a wheelbarrow you know and I think 'eeh dear me' but you see course it's like everything else I mean you'll probably be able to look back when you're a y- an older man and think to yourself 'how did we do so and so' things will have changed again you know when (interruption) by the time

(interruption) That's right

You're an older man

They will have They're changing already (NAME)

So aren't you pleased you weren't born when we were born?

(laughter)

I think it (laughter) I think it was the Frieda when I (interruption) used to

(interruption) Yes it was uh-huh

When I used to (interruption) travel

(interruption) Called the

(interruption) The Frieda

(interruption) Called the ferry the Frieda that's right

Uh-huh

The Frieda Currion was it?

I think it might have been that I think it was actually

Uh-huh

Yes I'm just wondering where what's that?

Well that's King Street

Oh is it

Uh-huh

That's like that's I think it's like nineteen thirty-nine

Yes that's not very far not long ago there's two erm phone boxes there I can't remember them being there but they must have been

Oh this is not that many years ago because look at this bit here

No that one's quite modern

Yes this one is uh-huh

But I say I think the top one's nineteen thirty-six

(cough)

Oh the top one is it? And Cro-

Or around then

Uh-huh

I'm not too sure

But you know I mean when we were kids if I'd thought about going to Tyne Dock that was what that was abroad to me you know (laughter) from living a- on the Law Top when I was little I mean when I think nowadays I mean if I was younger I'd probably would still be going abroad you know for holidays

Mile End Road was

Well it was I mean

We weren't allowed down to mile (interruption) End Road

(interruption) End Road

And that was only at the bottom of the street

Uh-huh and em

Weren't allowed that

But you know I mean er nowadays well I'm not bothered about going anywhere you know I mean as things change

Well you've done it all

Well I've done it all and I mean er I think em over the last thirty years if (NAME) had been alive might have been different you know but er because I've been a widow for all these years I'm erm I'm quite happy with my life you know got my grandchildren now I didn't before you lot came I didn't have any thought your mother's never going to have any family

(laughter)

And all she could think about was her sports car you know and er but em once you lot came that was a different thing you know much nicer

Listen (NAME) wait till she's got ten grandchildren and then eight up till now great grandchildren

Is it eight now?

I've got eight great grandchildren and I've got another one (interruption) in

(interruption) In J-

July

Due this week

Oh the eighth of July that's right and that'll be nine so just another one and it'll be ten grandchildren ten great grandchildren and I leave for Australia tomorrow

(laughter) (cough)

I'm emigrating (laughter)

(cough)

Oh dear

Oh dear

Oh no happy days (NAME) they were (pause) yes (pause) so how about that then how's

Good actually

Is it b- is that all right for you?